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Status: Long, long time Contax and Yashica user; glad to be here and hope to contribute.
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on Jun 17, 2023 10:33:22 GMT
Posted: Jun 17, 2023 10:33:22 GMT
This interesting lens was unknown to me until I spotted it on eBay today: Auto Chinon 21mm f3.5 by Tomioka.  Tomioka Auto Chinon 21mm f3.5It also appeared in an Auto Rikenon guise... What intrigues me is why it took so long for Yashica to produce a 21mm f3.5 lens for a 35mm camera; the first was the C/Y ML version (the DX 21mm f3.5 was an enlarging lens for the Atoron). The DX 21mm f3.3 was a retrofocus type and then we had the DS 20mm f3.3 and its later ML version. The fact that Tomioka had produced a conventional 21mm f3.5 lens in an M42 mount for the Chinon and Rikenon brands but was not asked to do so for Yashica's Auto Yashinon range seems odd, though it may be that as the DS 20mm f3.3 was well-established as a non-retrofocus design, the company saw no need to produce a 21mm given the closeness of both focal length and maximum aperture. But as to the eBay listing (number:154439543667), at a discounted asking price of $2382.60, I'm not sure there'll be a rush... You can buy the legendary Zeiss 21mm f2.8 T* Distagon in the C/Y mount for that amount. |
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on Jun 17, 2023 16:22:16 GMT
Last Edit: Jun 17, 2023 16:25:10 GMT by lumiworx
... You can buy the legendary Zeiss 21mm f2.8 T* Distagon in the C/Y mount for that amount. ... or if one doesn't mind a few extra degrees of view, buy a couple of Zeiss 18mm f/4 Distagons, and keep one as a spare. Probably still have money left over for a Contax body (or two). I can certainly understand the rarity factor, but I still have to be practical about a purchase if it's a usable tool at the same time that it's a collectable. I can't fathom ever buying a lens like these and then have them sitting on a shelf for eternity. |
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on Jun 20, 2023 18:16:09 GMT
Last Edit: Jun 20, 2023 19:34:41 GMT by xkaes
I asked the same question as I read about this. The only thing that I can think of is that Yashica thought that the lens would not sell well enough not only because of the existing 21mm and the cost, but because the retro-focus design must have made it more expensive. Still, it seems odd because the retro-focus lens would be easier to use. Minolta stopped selling their NON-retro-focus 21mm lens as soon as they developed their retro-focusing 21mm version.
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on Jun 21, 2023 22:00:43 GMT
Posted: Jun 21, 2023 22:00:43 GMT
Some questions come to mind, and forgive me for not doing a thorough search first... For the image shown by xkaes , I assume that the 20mm is a rectilinear retrofocus design while the 21mm is a rectilinear reflex design - if I'm interpreting the optical designs correctly. That would leave me thinking that the 21mm came first, and the 20mm was intended to replace it. With them both being on the same page, that gives the impression that they were in stock in sufficient enough quantities that they were both concurrently available for sale at one point. If any of the above rings true, then I'd think that Chinon's model (and perhaps, others) came out at the first glimpse of the retrofocusing 20mm, but oddly enough, the pictured Chinon is a 21mm of the same f/3.5 speed as both the 20 and 21. Obviously the Chinon isn't made by another maker as it bears the Tomioka label, so unless there's something afoot, there's no doubt what it's origins are. Toss in the Auto Yashinon DS 20mm f/3.3 and the hometown field is looking very crowded in the M42 era, but that's not the end of it. These are part of the draft list, and pulled them from the current spreadsheet entries... | Name - Focal Length | Speed | Mount | Optics | Notes | | Auto Yashinon DS 20mm | f/3.3 | M42 | 11/9 | Above linked lens. Presumably correct on optics, and matches the above non-DS lens, or ??? | | Yashinon DS 21mm | f/3.3 | M42 | 8/5 | Above Reflex lens - Presumably correct, or ??? | | Yashinon DX 21mm | f/3.4 | M42 | 8/5 | Atoron - ??? - then mount, speed, designation are incorrect, + Optics count/grouping seems excessive for this tiny lens | | Yashica ML 21mm | f/3.5 | C/Y | 12/8 | Presumably correct
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One added detail on my DS 20mm... it doesn't have the striped, grip, but uses the modern pyramid shaped pattern. |
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on Jun 22, 2023 1:33:04 GMT
Posted: Jun 22, 2023 1:33:04 GMT
I haven't researched this in any way, but using Minolta as a guide, they came out with their first SLR in 1958 and did not add mirror lock-up in their SLRs until 1962 at the same time they introduced their first super-wide lens -- 21mm non-retro-focus lens, which needed MLU. They replaced that 21mm with a faster, retro-focus 21mm version in 1971 -- almost a decade later. I assume it took other optical manufacturers quite a while to make the switch, as well -- so dates for these lenses might hold a clue.
The early 21mm was Minolta only lens that needed MLU, so Minolta spent a lot of money adding a feature that very few people would ever used. I have to assume that, at the time, Minolta thought that other, future, lenses would need MLU too.
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