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on May 15, 2020 22:06:58 GMT
Posted: May 15, 2020 22:06:58 GMT
Since the Minister III was never produced in a Japanese plant that I'm aware of, but the 1st and 2nd versions were started in Japan and moved to Hong Kong... the "Processed..." may have been a nice way of saying that it was designed in Japan, contained some parts produced in Japan (I'm thinking the lenses were coming from Tomioka's Tokyo plant) and then the remainder was produced and assembled in Hong Kong.
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on May 15, 2020 23:27:12 GMT
Posted: May 15, 2020 23:27:12 GMT
Since the Minister III was never produced in a Japanese plant that I'm aware of, but the 1st and 2nd versions were started in Japan and moved to Hong Kong... the "Processed..." may have been a nice way of saying that it was designed in Japan, contained some parts produced in Japan (I'm thinking the lenses were coming from Tomioka's Tokyo plant) and then the remainder was produced and assembled in Hong Kong. It's interesting to note that the reference to HKG is only on the early version; the later one with the DX lens carries Japan below the serial number. I do find it difficult to follow Yashica's protocols sometimes.
I'm about to receive another camera that 'does not exist' (like the DX 50mm f2 in C/Y mount) which is a FX-A with a gold 'Demonstrator' baseplate from an ex-Yashica person in Hamburg. Weird thing is that I saw the FX-A at Photokina but don't recall a gold baseplate though the one I saw was attached to a 139 Winder which might have been why I don't recall it. I thought that only the original RTS had gold demo plates.
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on May 24, 2020 8:50:03 GMT
Posted: May 24, 2020 8:50:03 GMT
The main topic of my Yashica 35 page is, obviously, the Yashica 35. I have also covered the YK and YL as the following models whilst the 35 was still available. The final section, "T he Next Generation", was a general wrap up illustrating where Yashica was going. It was a bit sloppy really and coincidentally, I have just finished researching and revising the section with a particular focus on the M3/Minister III (in fact I had come to see the "Processed in Hong Kong" example from a different source than this site and that had been the impetus). My main resource for release info is the Japanese specialist magazine, "Camera Collectors' News" of July 1987. Most web sites claim the Minister III was released in 1963, presumably it was believed to follow the Minister II and arrive before the Minister D, (I am ashamed to say that I had followed the sheep on that one). The magazine article agrees with the list provided by lumiworx, March 1966. The magazine also tells us that the model was released as the M3 but after Leica threatened, or took, legal action, the name was changed to Minister III. When I'm serious about research, one of the first things I do is collect as many many photos as I can and then enter the salient details into a database. Also, anyone familiar with my site will know that I believe that Yashica serial numbers from at least 1958 (some from 1957) to the late 60s for most models feature a date code. My database for the Minister III is tiny by my usual standards, just 16 cameras but it does tell us some things. There are two serial number ranges, 7 digit from 6012326 to 8081228 (1966 January, which would fit with a March release, to 1968 August) and 6 digit H 808089 to H 921159. The 1966 to 1968 cameras are engraved "Japan" on the back of the top plate below the serial number. The "H" numbers are typical Hong Kong related serial numbers also found on some other models, e.g. late Yashica D TLRs and a couple of Minister Ds. However, these are a bit messy. As well as the "Processed in Hong Kong", several have the more common "Hong Kong" and a couple have no engraving on the back (apart from serial number) but are engraved "Japan" inside the accessory shoe. There seems to be no particular order to which engraving appears first or next so I'm confused by that. Confirming the magazine's claim, the earliest 5 (or, 1/3rd) of the cameras I have found have “M-3” engraved on the front next to where “Minister III” is found on later cameras with “Yashica” there on the M3 instead. The first 7 cameras (5 M3s and 2 Minister IIIs) in my database have Yashinon DX lenses. There is also a later Minister III example with one but it is an outlier amongst plain Yashinons and I'm not convinced that the camera has not been fiddled with.
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on May 27, 2020 10:23:48 GMT
Posted: May 27, 2020 10:23:48 GMT
The main topic of my Yashica 35 page is, obviously, the Yashica 35. I have also covered the YK and YL as the following models whilst the 35 was still available. The final section, "T he Next Generation", was a general wrap up illustrating where Yashica was going. It was a bit sloppy really and coincidentally, I have just finished researching and revising the section with a particular focus on the M3/Minister III (in fact I had come to see the "Processed in Hong Kong" example from a different source than this site and that had been the impetus). My main resource for release info is the Japanese specialist magazine, "Camera Collectors' News" of July 1987. Most web sites claim the Minister III was released in 1963, presumably it was believed to follow the Minister II and arrive before the Minister D, (I am ashamed to say that I had followed the sheep on that one). The magazine article agrees with the list provided by lumiworx, March 1966. The magazine also tells us that the model was released as the M3 but after Leica threatened, or took, legal action, the name was changed to Minister III. When I'm serious about research, one of the first things I do is collect as many many photos as I can and then enter the salient details into a database. Also, anyone familiar with my site will know that I believe that Yashica serial numbers from at least 1958 (some from 1957) to the late 60s for most models feature a date code. My database for the Minister III is tiny by my usual standards, just 16 cameras but it does tell us some things. There are two serial number ranges, 7 digit from 6012326 to 8081228 (1966 January, which would fit with a March release, to 1968 August) and 6 digit H 808089 to H 921159. The 1966 to 1968 cameras are engraved "Japan" on the back of the top plate below the serial number. The "H" numbers are typical Hong Kong related serial numbers also found on some other models, e.g. late Yashica D TLRs and a couple of Minister Ds. However, these are a bit messy. As well as the "Processed in Hong Kong", several have the more common "Hong Kong" and a couple have no engraving on the back (apart from serial number) but are engraved "Japan" inside the accessory shoe. There seems to be no particular order to which engraving appears first or next so I'm confused by that. Confirming the magazine's claim, the earliest 5 (or, 1/3rd) of the cameras I have found have “M-3” engraved on the front next to where “Minister III” is found on later cameras with “Yashica” there on the M3 instead. The first 7 cameras (5 M3s and 2 Minister IIIs) in my database have Yashinon DX lenses. There is also a later Minister III example with one but it is an outlier amongst plain Yashinons and I'm not convinced that the camera has not been fiddled with.
This is very helpful information but there is a further oddity in the serial numbers: there is a 6-digit Japan model with a 'N' prefix currently being sold on Ebay. How does this fit into the scheme of things?
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on May 27, 2020 11:46:23 GMT
Posted: May 27, 2020 11:46:23 GMT
This may or may not play into an "N" prefixed serial, but is it possible that some of these numbers can seem out of sequence because the part that's oddly numbered is actually a replacement part? Top plates on cameras/bodies and lens barrels get dented or deformed and replaced. Factory replacement parts for them would have a serial number pre-stamped on them, and it may not match the origins of the replaced part.
NOS OEM parts that I've purchased have serials on them that I can only assume were recorded by someone, somewhere, as official replacement parts for the sake of warranty and servicing requirements. They won't match serials issued against finished parts, but I have to assume that someone needs to know what their warranty status is once they're used in a repair.
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on May 27, 2020 22:09:58 GMT
Posted: May 27, 2020 22:09:58 GMT
This may or may not play into an "N" prefixed serial, but is it possible that some of these numbers can seem out of sequence because the part that's oddly numbered is actually a replacement part? Top plates on cameras/bodies and lens barrels get dented or deformed and replaced. Factory replacement parts for them would have a serial number pre-stamped on them, and it may not match the origins of the replaced part. NOS OEM parts that I've purchased have serials on them that I can only assume were recorded by someone, somewhere, as official replacement parts for the sake of warranty and servicing requirements. They won't match serials issued against finished parts, but I have to assume that someone needs to know what their warranty status is once they're used in a repair. It's an interesting thought. For C/Y replacement parts such as top-plates and base-plates that carried serial numbers, there was no variation from the norm. About 4 years ago there was a US seller on Ebay that had dozens of unused replacement parts for the early Contax models (RTS, 137MD/A, 139 and 159) and all the FR series - I bought most of it over a period of several months - but none showed any special notations. Of course, you may well be correct; that does not mean that Yashica/Kyocera did not keep an inventory list of 'spares serial numbers' in order to stop bogus warranty claims.
As far as I can recall, the only C/Y base-plates that carried bespoke serials were the Contax RTS Demonstrator models (gold base-plates usually stamped 'Demonstrator') and special editions (the gold Anniversary RTS + gold 50 1.4 Planar sets, NASA 137MD, dealership rewards, etc.). That being said, I bought a Yashica FR and FR1 with a D-prefix from a US seller some years back but in every other respect, the cameras were perfectly normal. I'm very curious to see what the gold base-plated FX-A has to reveal...
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on May 28, 2020 6:58:33 GMT
Posted: May 28, 2020 6:58:33 GMT
I can't speak for other models than TLRs but Yashica's practice with replacement parts bearing a serial number, typically nameplates or focusing hoods, was to use the same form of serial number but higher than production was likely to reach. There are a number of examples from the late 1950s and a 635 from the 60s given on the Serial Numbers page of my site which indicate this but the clincher are three Yashica Mat-EM hoods. This is what is on the site: "Since I wrote this section, contributor Tom Heckhaus has been through his Yashica bits and pieces. In the 1980s, Yashica in the US sold off its stock of TLR spares and Tom was one of the purchasers. He has three Yashica Mat-EM focusing hood assemblies. Until now, the highest EM serial number in my database was EM 7070xxx, July 1967 by my reckoning, and very close to the claimed end date of August 1967. Tom's three hoods have the following numbers EM 9120238, EM 9120277 and EM 9120286, all suggesting December 1969. One of these is below (the number is hard to read but zoomed in, EM 91202xx is clear enough)." In regard to the 6 digit number with an "N" prefix on eBay, I presume a Minister III, I'm having trouble finding it. I'll search again later but without having seen it, I have some ideas. Over the last couple of days, I have again revised The Next Generation and I believe the answer is in there. Date coded serial numbers for TLRs ended in 1980 but for rangefinders, they ended in the 2nd half of the 60s. I'm the first to admit that my database of fixed lens rangefinder serial numbers for the 60s models is relatively tiny, nevertheless, there is a discernible pattern. The highest prefixed date coded serial number I have is for a Minister D, MD 7090451 which I believe is from 1967, September. The D is actually a good example to use. I have 8 similar numbers starting with MD 3122756 (1963, December). Of these 6 have typical 7 digit numbers (TLRs from this period never go above 7 digits) but 2 have 8 digits. There is an explanation in The Next Generation section and it is also noted in regard to the Y16 on the Serial numbers page. In brief, the first 3 digits still hold good for the date code but 4 digits isn't enough if planned production for that model for the month exceeded 9,999 cameras. The only other rangefinders affected that I have found are the two Minimatics. Now, after MD 7090451, there are 7 Ds with 6 digit serial numbers T 050357 to T 808682. These are still engraved "Japan". Then there are two "H" numbers, presumably standing for Hong Kong, H 110214 and H 136291 without a country engraving. Along with the Yashica D, the Yashica J is another early model that makes it to the USA 1969 price list. Its 7 digit numbers were prefixed "J". I have only found numbers up to J 4090904 but then there are 2 non-date coded (as far as I can tell) 6 digit numbers N 710888 and N 725399, the cameras still engraved "Japan". Following these is a camera with 6 digit number 006943 without prefix but engraved "Hong Kong" and then two "H" numbers H 023957 and H 127457 without a country engraving. Presumably, the Minister III with "N" number is similar to the D and J, the number probably fits between the date coded ones and the Hong Kong ones, it's just that i haven't found any yet.
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on May 28, 2020 8:04:22 GMT
Posted: May 28, 2020 8:04:22 GMT
I can't speak for other models than TLRs but Yashica's practice with replacement parts bearing a serial number, typically nameplates or focusing hoods, was to use the same form of serial number but higher than production was likely to reach. There are a number of examples from the late 1950s and a 635 from the 60s given on the Serial Numbers page of my site which indicate this but the clincher are three Yashica Mat-EM hoods. This is what is on the site: "Since I wrote this section, contributor Tom Heckhaus has been through his Yashica bits and pieces. In the 1980s, Yashica in the US sold off its stock of TLR spares and Tom was one of the purchasers. He has three Yashica Mat-EM focusing hood assemblies. Until now, the highest EM serial number in my database was EM 7070xxx, July 1967 by my reckoning, and very close to the claimed end date of August 1967. Tom's three hoods have the following numbers EM 9120238, EM 9120277 and EM 9120286, all suggesting December 1969. One of these is below (the number is hard to read but zoomed in, EM 91202xx is clear enough)." In regard to the 6 digit number with an "N" prefix on eBay, I presume a Minister III, I'm having trouble finding it. I'll search again later but without having seen it, I have some ideas. Over the last couple of days, I have again revised The Next Generation and I believe the answer is in there. Date coded serial numbers for TLRs ended in 1980 but for rangefinders, they ended in the 2nd half of the 60s. I'm the first to admit that my database of fixed lens rangefinder serial numbers for the 60s models is relatively tiny, nevertheless, there is a discernible pattern. The highest prefixed date coded serial number I have is for a Minister D, MD 7090451 which I believe is from 1967, September. The D is actually a good example to use. I have 8 similar numbers starting with MD 3122756 (1963, December). Of these 6 have typical 7 digit numbers (TLRs from this period never go above 7 digits) but 2 have 8 digits. There is an explanation in The Next Generation section and it is also noted in regard to the Y16 on the Serial numbers page. In brief, the first 3 digits still hold good for the date code but 4 digits isn't enough if planned production for that model for the month exceeded 9,999 cameras. The only other rangefinders affected that I have found are the two Minimatics. Now, after MD 7090451, there are 7 Ds with 6 digit serial numbers T 050357 to T 808682. These are still engraved "Japan". Then there are two "H" numbers, presumably standing for Hong Kong, H 110214 and H 136291 without a country engraving. Along with the Yashica D, the Yashica J is another early model that makes it to the USA 1969 price list. Its 7 digit numbers were prefixed "J". I have only found numbers up to J 4090904 but then there are 2 non-date coded (as far as I can tell) 6 digit numbers N 710888 and N 725399, the cameras still engraved "Japan". Following these is a camera with 6 digit number 006943 without prefix but engraved "Hong Kong" and then two "H" numbers H 023957 and H 127457 without a country engraving. Presumably, the Minister III with "N" number is similar to the D and J, the number probably fits between the date coded ones and the Hong Kong ones, it's just that i haven't found any yet. Hi there,
Check Ebay item: 254598728306 which is from Belgium. The fifth photo shows the serial number - and it's another Japan version with a non-DX lens.
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on May 29, 2020 0:51:46 GMT
Posted: May 29, 2020 0:51:46 GMT
Thanks! I still can't see it on the US site, perhaps because I am accessing it from Australia but I went direct to the Belgian site.
Some things Yashica did are hard to follow and the Minister III is one. With most models, "H" seems to mean "Hong Kong". Sometimes it is explicit and "Hong Kong" is engraved and sometimes it is implied by the absence of the "Japan" engraving. As I noted earlier, with the Minister III, "H" numbers include cameras with "Hong Kong" and "Processed in Hong Kong" along with others with "Japan" engraved in the accessory shoe. In no particular order.
The 6 digit "N" number N 803098 is the earliest of the 6 digit numbers and appears to belong to the same series as the "H" numbers, the first being H 808089. So what I said earlier in relation to the Yashica D and J about an in between number series might still apply or in this case there may be a closer connection to the "H" numbers, i.e. perhaps 6 digit Japanese cameras were going to use "N" but then both HK and Japanese cameras used "H". This is just wild guessing now and way beyond my pay grade - most of what I know relates to date coded numbers.
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on Dec 8, 2020 17:45:54 GMT
Last Edit: Dec 8, 2020 17:47:25 GMT by moggi1964
I recently became the owner of a Yashica 700 and a big part of my reason for getting it was that they are relatively uncommon and I like that. I also picked up a Minister D too in case I needed parts for the 700 (though a limited number are transferrable I suppose). It needed a bit of work doing on it and the place I sent it to said it would not be economically viable for it to be fixed. That just made me more determined to get it fixed so it is currently with Newton Ellis & Co in Liverpool getting sorted. I hope to have it back in a week or two. By the time it's back with me I'll have likely spent at least twice what it is worth but that doesn't matter so long as she performs as I think she will. The serial number is: MC5011876 Japan and I'm sure that tells me something, though other than it was made in Japan I'm not sure what Here's a picture or three. Oh, and hello by the way!
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on Dec 9, 2020 1:30:07 GMT
Posted: Dec 9, 2020 1:30:07 GMT
Welcome to the Forum, Moggi. I think we discussed this camera over on RFF. The cosmetic condition looks good, so it shouldn't take NE&Co long to sort it out. Getting it CLA'd is worth the money for a camera that should work fine then for another twenty years or more. Make sure to let us know how it turns out.
PF
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on Dec 9, 2020 1:42:12 GMT
Posted: Dec 9, 2020 1:42:12 GMT
Welcome to the Forum moggi1964.
That is a fine looking camera you have there; that lens is a stunner! If you can find the time, as ridgeblue has asked, to let us know how the CLA has gone, it will be much appreciated as finding good repairers that can still handle cameras of this vintage is a real bonus.
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on Dec 9, 2020 23:19:51 GMT
Posted: Dec 9, 2020 23:19:51 GMT
Hiya Ridgeblue, nice to see you over here too. Biggles3, I will definitely be back to update you. Newton and Ellis have a great reputation and their communication so far has been terrific. Can't wait to get the 700 back and shoot some film. I just decided to challenge 3 of my team mates from work (who I haven't seen in person since March) to a film camera challenge. I'll supply the cameras and film. One of them gets a Lomography Diana with 400 colour film; one of them gets a Hanimex 35 or a Canon Teleshot and the other gets my Minister D. The latter two get B&W film - Kentmere 100. They have a month to shoot and I'll pay for the developing too. So let's see how the D fares
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on Jan 27, 2021 14:09:19 GMT
Posted: Jan 27, 2021 14:09:19 GMT
So the 700 arrived back today after a good service and the conversion to 1.5v batteries (*wasn't expecting that). I loaded a roll of Portra 400 into my Minister D a few days ago so I'll wait till that roll is done then stick a roll in the 700. I ended up not giving the Minister D to my friends to use and the Diana had problems winding on so one got a Minolta 700; one got a Hanimex 35 and the other got the Canon Teleshot. I set a deadline of end of this month for them to finish their rolls and then send them back to me. I'm looking forward to seeing what they shot but I'm looking forward to using the 700 more
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on Jan 27, 2021 15:21:46 GMT
Posted: Jan 27, 2021 15:21:46 GMT
So the 700 arrived back today after a good service and the conversion to 1.5v batteries (*wasn't expecting that). I loaded a roll of Portra 400 into my Minister D a few days ago so I'll wait till that roll is done then stick a roll in the 700. I ended up not giving the Minister D to my friends to use and the Diana had problems winding on so one got a Minolta 700; one got a Hanimex 35 and the other got the Canon Teleshot. I set a deadline of end of this month for them to finish their rolls and then send them back to me. I'm looking forward to seeing what they shot but I'm looking forward to using the 700 more Thank you for keeping us up to date on the servicing. It sounds like Newton & Ellis is the place to go; I love that they modified the camera to use 1.5v cells without being asked. I'm looking forward to your report on the image quality of the 700.
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