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Status: Long, long time Contax and Yashica user; glad to be here and hope to contribute.
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on Feb 17, 2021 22:32:32 GMT
Posted: Feb 17, 2021 22:32:32 GMT
I wonder whether any of the many luminaries on this Forum can solve a puzzle as shown in the piccie below which I have revisited today? 9 vs 6 bladesIt clearly shows the early version of the lens on the left (the 621st made, from Oct 1959) and the more familiar type on the right from the main production run in 1960. The original lens produces a much more pleasing image, especially with a less intrusive bokeh, so does anyone here know why Yashica/Tomioka decided to reduce the number of blades to 6? At a time when Yashica was in pursuit of a reputation for excellence, why downgrade (albeit not by much) its standard lens from outstanding to merely very good? The dreaded bean-counters had not yet curtailed the pursuit of excellence in 1960 but was this merely a cost-cutting exercise? Fewer blades = fewer parts and speedier construction which would probably save a few Yen... I had wondered why the earliest numbered versions of the 5.5cm f1.8 commanded a premium. For information, both lenses are set to f5.6; it's interesting to speculate how much more light appears to be let in by the early version as the aperture is undoubtedly larger. I plan to run a comparative test shortly.
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on Feb 18, 2021 2:15:56 GMT
Posted: Feb 18, 2021 2:15:56 GMT
That is a puzzler. There are LOTS of lenses of that era that have LOTS more than seven blades. Sometimes I wonder why some lenses have so many blades -- like 15! But over the decades the fewer blades gradually won out (there were also a lot of changes in the SHAPE of blades) I've seen some lenses that ended up with only three blades! I can't think of any other reason other than $$$ -- not just cost of an extra blade, but cost of manufacturing/assembly. It's somewhat amazing what corners got cut from some great gear -- not just lenses -- cameras, flashes, etc.
But it's always great to find gear that retained features that could have easily been dropped.
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on Feb 18, 2021 12:34:57 GMT
Last Edit: Feb 18, 2021 12:37:04 GMT by lumiworx
You are probably both right. It might be a case where the battleship becomes a row boat because the bean counters got too much say. It's unfortunate, but it has and will likely continue to happen all too often. Growing companies that spend too much time on generating profits over products, often don't pay attention to long term goals and someone switches direction as a reaction to what happens, and many times it's not for the better. Someone might be great at balancing a budget, but are worthless as an engineer, or vice/versa.
The composition and thickness of sheet metal on the Model T that's still running (in it's original paint) in the 21st century versus my 1959 Chevy Impala's 4 foot long rusted seams at the hood and fender lines in 1972 that would flap in the breeze - or - the untarnished quality of 1950's stainless steel flatware over the flakey and pitted finishes on the minimum chromium alloy cheapos of the 1980's onward. Given enough time on the planet, we've all seen results like these, and I'd doubt that Yashica managed to get through 60+ years without it happening to them, and it certainly looks like the Pentamatic years had more than a couple of misteps in that direction that reek of burned and counted beans.
It's probably not possible to be certain if that's the case, since Yashica was a privately held Japanese company in and around the Showa era. Corporate culture of the time would dictate that any finacial faux pas wouldn't even be aknowledged out loud, let alone be publicy discussed beyond management's walls. The bigger the issue, the tighter the lips would be.
Just a guess, but the combination of buying (and paying for) Zunow and Nicca in the late 50's, maybe the development costs for lenses that obviously never materialised in the Pentamatic line, then ramping up design and production costs to get back into M42 territory with a whole new lineup... it all may have created a constantly squawking banker or accountant to finally cut, cut, cut until everything was bleeding in buckets.
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on Feb 18, 2021 13:01:32 GMT
Last Edit: Feb 18, 2021 18:22:11 GMT by xkaes
A few companies found (and tried) an alternative approach to cutting corners on their lenses -- they produced a less expensive line of lenses and kept their top-of-the-line lenses "as is". Minolta perhaps had the largest budget line of lenses -- although the optical formulas were exactly the same, and so was the build quality. For example, they did not cut the number of blades in the diaphragm.
Their Celtic line continued to use their older single lens coating instead of multi-coating -- which helped reduce the cost. They also cut a few other corners. For example, the red alignment bump of the MC Rokkor-X line was replaced with a painted red dot, DOF buttons are not included, lens cases and hoods were accessories, the warranty period was three years shorter, the focal length was not painted on the lens barrel, and the lens caps are less-expensive, push-on types. Cutting these corners, cut the sales price quite a bit. The original line of Celtic lenses was quite extensive, and even included a 50mm macro lens -- but nothing wider than 28mm or longer than 200mm.
In some ways, this is how some photographers consider the Contax vs the Yashica C/Y lens lines.
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on Feb 18, 2021 14:11:59 GMT
Posted: Feb 18, 2021 14:11:59 GMT
More blades, more close to a perfect circle, so maybe it helps to better distribute the light incoming from a circular shaped lens, than with a hexagon or rhombus shape. My knowledge about optics is zero, but it seems that changing from 8 to 6 blades was not affecting much of the final results on the picture, in comparison with the benefits of simplifying the design, reducing parts and costs.
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on Feb 18, 2021 20:16:10 GMT
Posted: Feb 18, 2021 20:16:10 GMT
You nailed it. The more blades, the closer to an actual circle. And as summarized on WIKI:
"The shape of the iris opening has a direct relation with the appearance of the blurred out-of-focus areas in an image (AKA, bokeh). A rounder opening produces softer and more natural out-of-focus areas."
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on Feb 18, 2021 22:09:56 GMT
Posted: Feb 18, 2021 22:09:56 GMT
I have 5,5cm 1.8 M42 Silver version,
6 blades, serial start with 50****
im not sure if this is the same lens / different mount ?
Maybe a bit off topic question ...
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